Raiding and the consumables dilemma
Praetorian, over on Elitist Jerks has posted an interesting examination in the role that consumable buffs play in raiding. While this just popped into my own guild's forums, and although it's a couple of weeks old now, the point is still current and relevant.Praetorian summarizes by saying:
"Consumables are too powerful, such that Blizzard's raid designers are forced into the untenable position of balancing around unbuffed groups and having their content steamrolled, or balancing around buffed groups and forcing players into a cycle of unpleasant farming in order to even have a chance."
He goes on into great detail, breaking down the differences between the different tiers of raiding gear in terms of how they help in raiding, and then into the consumables. In the end, he calls for a change in how raids are approached by Blizzard in the development phase of the game.
What do you think of Praetorian's analysis? Do you carry a lot of consumables with you, and do you think things need to change?
[Thanks to Forge for the submission!]
Filed under: Analysis / Opinion, Economy, Raiding
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 1)
Ralex Dec 26th 2006 7:04PM
It's an extremely well thought out and written post and I agree completely.
Our guild has raid requirements for consumables, and we will do single world buffs for our newest Naxx encounters, but we aren't bleeding edge like EJ.
Naxx requires a high level of consumables for many of the encounters, and penalizes raids that don't use them. This has caused all sorts of problems for our guild in that some folks don't want to do the work for the consumables and slack off, that causes problems with others, and so on.
Jason Dec 26th 2006 9:20PM
While I see his points, I feel he's mistaken in that the raid team needs to design around them. IMHO, I feel that the raid team ignores buffs available when designing encounters; I think his points on how easy they are with them proves this.
With that said, I feel that this is good encounter design. I think that the raid team should continue to design encounters in this manner. If you want a crutch, then you can feel free to farm materials to use consumables. However, if you want a 'pure' experience, then by all means, leave your buffs and consumables at the door. No one is forcing you to farm for them. No one is forcing you to use them.
Personally, I use consumables. I have a 60 rogue who's an alchemist. The only pots I really farm for him are either pots to self buff while running instances or farming money, and mana /resist pots to hand off to my 60 shaman, which I raid with. Are they useful to have for learning encounters? Sure, but by no means are they 'required' as some guilds see them. Mana and resist pots could be replaced by a competent heal rotation. Additionally, a proper heal rotation split between your MT and anyone taking AoE damage where applicable could easily substitute for some of the pots you see right now.
Ultimately, I don't think there's a dilemma there at all, for raid designers, or players. I think it's something largely made up, and propagated here by someone who's either sick of encounters that are too easy in his/her estimation, and rightfully sees consumables and buffs as the culprit. The other option is that this individual is tired of farming mats for consumables. I don't blame him/her for either case. Farming to raid sucks; encounters that don't present a challenge suck.
Tigraine Dec 27th 2006 6:29AM
@#2
Some Encounters in Naxxramas are almost undoable without Consumeables and Buffs.
Take Patchwork for instance, without properly flasking your Tanks you have no way doing this (if you haven't cleared all the other wings yet).
Loatheb costs 150 Shadow Resist Pots per try. If you really hand out that many consumeables to your raid you don't want to wipe because of a lack of DPS. Yes, you'll buff up. Burning 600 SR Pots per day isn't worth it.
Consumeables give you really the edge.
I can only speak for my rogue. Buffing him takes my stats way off limits.
Mongoose, Sharpening Stones, Giants and Squid boost me(with raid buffs) from around 30% crit to 44% crit. My AP goes from 1k to 1.7k (with Battle shout and Aura).
Well, there is definately a difference between 37% crit and 44, don't you think?
Same for Wizard oil and Arcane elixirs and Shadow Might on my warlock. Increase is at almost 100+ spelldmg.
Thats mutch to farm, but it definately buffs my character really hard.
aaron Dec 27th 2006 6:17PM
If you could do loatheb with resist gear instead shadow pots then you MIGHT not need the shadow pots.
Because of the way healing works in current wow (non BC wow) burst healing + tank hp are pretty important. So your either using flasks or stacking the raid with healers / mana pots. At any rate, with a few weeks to go until BC we only need to farm a few weeks worth of pots :p
Juro Dec 28th 2006 5:45PM
I'm in the camp that actually enjoys farming for consumables...and raiding with every advantage possible.
Does it need a change? Well, not really. Farming Nature pots for AQ, Shadow pots for Naxx, Fire gear and consumables for MC...that's what sets the 40 man raid experience apart from running 5 mans, or 20 mans.
The preperation for battle, the readiness for bosses...it makes it a challenge. Just grabbing some healing potions on a thursday night and running an instance is no fun...it's the players that put in the time creating flasks, resistance gear and consumables, along with buff pots and food that sets them apart from the normal player, and makes the end-game worth while.
Understandable that not many people have hours upon hours to farm these things...but whats the fun in just grabbing any player with decent gear and throwing them in the high-end "hardcore" instances? It's just another way to set the hardcores apart from the casuals...
I know bosses like huhuran would be MUCH less rewarding the first time a guild takes her down if there was no gear and resistance pot farming...the preperation is for the goal, downing the boss. The game should be competetive, and there should be a difference between a mage who uses supreme power and one that doesn't in the end game...the ones that don't can't down the bosses.
Consumables SHOULD be required for any "eliete" raiding experience.