WoWMatrix responds to Curse and WoW Interface
by Eliah Hecht 
May 6th 2009 at 1:00PM
I thought the whole Curse and WoW Interface vs WoWMatrix scuffle was over, but the people at WoWMatrix have just fired back an "FAQ" giving their side of the story. I put FAQ in quotes because I'm not sure these are frequently asked questions so much as questions Matrix frequently wants to answer, but that's OK. I like the format.
Here is the situation as they put it: The Matrix people are respecting Curse/WI's demands that they quit using Curse/WI bandwidth, so as of now you can only get addons through WM that are hosted on the WM servers. They are hosting addons on their servers that the authors asked to be hosted there, or that are distributed under a free license (such as the GPL) that allows such re-hosting.
And now it starts to get contentious. Curse and WoW Interface claimed that WM was almost completely unresponsive to any kind of communication they tried to make, which is what forced them to take the drastic measures they took. WM, on the other hand, claim that Curse refused to negotiate and instead just tried to buy Matrix outright, whereas WM was trying to compensate for bandwidth, figure out how to use less bandwidth, and show Curse ads.
Basically, WM's side of the story is that they tried everything they could to work with WoW Interface and Curse in order to provide a single solution that was best for the user community - to quote them directly, "both Curse and WoWInterface are more concerned about their own profits than working with us to help better serve the gaming community."
This is, again, directly contradictory to what the Curse/WoWI release said, which is that Matrix showed very little interest in working with them, making only a token lowball offer to compensate for bandwidth, and just wanted to go on leeching, basically. Obviously at least one side is misrepresenting facts, although it's impossible to say which one.
On a final note, if you want to help the WoWMatrix folks, they encourage you to submit any addons that you want added that are under a free license, so that's one thing you can do to build their database.
[thanks, Chias]Filed under: AddOns
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 19)
Cheese Rations May 6th 2009 1:08PM
Go WoWMatrix! I tend to believe what they have to say mostly because I just hate Curse and wouldn't be surprised that they and WI would retaliate like this because WM refused a buyout.
I will *happily* use and even pay for premium access to an addon service if WoWMatrix were to make one. I refuse to subscribe to Curse's premium service due to their clunky Mac client, slow website, and poor attitude and would love to see WoWMatrix come out with a competing service.
Let's hope that WoWMatrix is able to build up an addon database that rivals both WI and Curse in size. I'm tired of having to use Curse's clunky Mac client for some addons, and WI's website for others. I should be able to get all of my addons in just one place and have them updated automatically through just one client. I will pay WoWMatrix the $30/year that Curse is asking for if they can do this.
Krick May 6th 2009 1:16PM
I completely agree with everything said above. I'd pay $30 a year to Wowmatrix as well.
...
Krick
http://www.tankadin.com
ben_man587 May 6th 2009 1:42PM
I also tend to believe WoWMatrix. My opinion of Curse has been pretty low ever since they stole WoWHead's interface for their own database.
WoWie Zowie May 6th 2009 1:54PM
^^ this
Preston May 6th 2009 1:56PM
I've always been on WowMatrix's side on this. Curse wants you to use their "Premium Service" and their godawful, horrible, super-crappy updater application. Every criticism I've heard about WoWMatrix has turned out to be false, such as not crediting authors for their addons, not linking to their websites, and so forth (all of that information is provided in the description box at the bottom of the window!).
Curse sees WoWMatrix as a threat to their pay service. That's why Curse blocked them.
Yeng May 6th 2009 2:07PM
As far as I'm concerned, I wouldn't pay money for any 'premium' add-on updater. The community provides the add-ons, why should you pay a 3rd party to automatically download/update them for you.
Personally I don't think any of the involved parties are worth spending money on.
themoonn May 6th 2009 2:39PM
@Yang
Companies charge for this service because people who use their auto updaters use considerably more bandwidth than those who update on their own. Typically, those who update on their own only update every few months, where an auto updater could update every day. These companies have to pay for this bandwidth, and they just pass that fee on to people who *choose* to use that service.
I do agree with you however thats its wasting money if you can do it on your own.
Morcego May 6th 2009 2:41PM
Considering we saw Curse Premium being released right after they blocked WowMatrix, one has to question Curse's motives.
So based on outside evidence alone, I'm most inclined to trust WowMatrix word on this one.
Tal May 6th 2009 2:42PM
Someone explain something to me. Where is it written than content published on the web has to be consumed by a graphic web browser?
Maybe I don't understand fully what WoWMatrix was doing but if they provided a application that consumes public facing content from something other than a web browser, how is that stealing bandwidth? As a software developer, I could write a utility application myself that does the same thing. That's not stealing bandwidth. I could then give that same utility application to my friends to use, they are not stealing bandwidth, nor am I.
WoWMatrix, as far I as understand, is simply providing an alternate way to browse and deliver web-based content and data. It's an overly simplified and very targeted web browser.
On topic of this article, there is no black and white / right or wrong in the situation but there is a very interesting subject to debate.
Ryan May 6th 2009 2:59PM
"Considering we saw Curse Premium being released right after they blocked WowMatrix, one has to question Curse's motives."
Their motives are to survive as a business, heaven forbid.
Tuhljin May 6th 2009 3:18PM
Well OF COURSE so many WoWInsider readers will believe WowMatrix because that's who you WANT (emotionally-based) to believe. As has been clear since Curse and WoWI cut off WM's unethical leeching, not only are you willing to put blind faith into WM (who presented a number of lies in their FAQ) and ignore uncontestable facts presented by addon authors to point out WM's reprehensible behavior, many of you are perfectly willing to side WM *DESPITE* knowing what WM has done.
Anyone who sides with WM is siding with the side of the issue with a long history of disrespect for the addon author community, the side that began by taking addons without permission, not giving author credit (only doing so after months of getting yelled at), then focused on bandwidth theft, and continues even now with URL spoofing (for example, questhelper.com instead of quest-helper.com) and editing addon code to remove copyright notices and to make it look like addons are up to date that are not (including editing the TOC and suppressing error messages). That's up to you if you want to do support someone like that, but it's hardly the logical response.
Vidi May 6th 2009 3:21PM
I agree.
Curse killed my easy addon upgrade without a secind thought and then demands I pay for their bugged client for the same ease?
The balls on curse are amazingly large.
They are a HOST. They dont write the addons. They sell ad space to Blizzard competition and make money doing it.
Hmmm...I should start a new website
Veras Gunn May 6th 2009 3:31PM
@Preston: Your ignorance regarding WoWMatrix criticisms that turned out to be false is also false. That section with in WoWMatrix was added after constant pestering by people in both Curse and Wowinterface courts.
Mr Magoo May 6th 2009 4:12PM
If was a more paranoid man I would think curse or wowinterface people were posting here also. :)
It seems like a clear cut case of two businesses fighting it out as is perfectly normal in the real world. The only weird bit is that their little fist fight has spilled out onto the street and everybody is pointing, laughing and shouting opinions.
In the end all that is going to happen is people will get/have got hurt and the world will forget and move on.
ON CUSTOMERS:
They are electrons. They take the shortest path. Whatever is easiest. 99% of them don't pay diddly and wont. Many would pirate the addons if they could. (P2P) Most could not give a toss about the addon devs or their hard work. (until it is gone of course and then they will cry)
However there are a core set of "philanthropists" that WILL donate/pay and DO care. There are also some that would pay if there was a good reason to - currently there is none.
This is the market that this whole thing is about.
ON WM:
Wowmatrix seems to provide the better client as far as most of the public is concerned and it runs well on any of the platforms people care about. They are effectively free also which is important and appears to only care about donations and delivering addons in the quickest and least fuss way possible. (i.e. what the customer wants)
The bad thing is that WM does not seem to care about the addon guys or hosters at all. They can belly ache all they want about it, but the fact remains they were leeching and removing the revenue stream that others were counting on to host/develop their products. It also appears they were rather arrogant and naive on this point as to what could be done to stop them. In this case I call that WM got what you would expect. (NB: I am not using the word "deserve" on purposed - that has no meaning in business! :) )
ON CURSE:
The curse client has, in the past, lost out to WM in all respects. I am using their current client (on Win) and to be honest I can't see anything wrong with it. It works for me and is prettier than WM. I know Mac users are getting it rough.
However the main difference with curse is that everything they do and say screams the fact that they are a slavering dog just chaffing at the bit to create a situation where I am forced to give them money for hosting other people's hard work. I am sure they pay them a "cut" and, like always, I am sure this cut is unfairly small since they, like the RIAA/MPAA, control the supply chain. (for now, anyway since WM has been hamstrung)
Currently they are "coercive" in that they are restricting bandwidth and features so forth to unpaying customers and I personally have no problem with this.
I doubt if they actually manage to ruin WM that it will continue like this. They "cunningly" used the 3.1 patch to lauch their client/premium service and attack WM.
One expects that they would continue in this vein once WM was gone.
I don't think they are "evil" as this is just business. But in the spirit of the free market I would warn against allowing curse to become a monopoly of any sort. They tend to be ugly, expensive and ultimately terrible for consumers.
WOW has "laid down the law" (or tried to) on this and made it clear that they want addons to be totally non-commerical ventures - even donation buttons are out. As much as this is a threat to curse it could also be a massive win if they are smart enough.
Many addon devs will be throwing up their hands and go GPL as they are forced to open their source (whether they like it or not).
However Curse's revenue sharing could now become the main or even ONLY way for addon devs to spin some cash for all their hard work. They could even allow the devs to put a donation button on things to boot. :)
This would attrach addon devs like flys I would imagine and simultaneously block out WM as they have a very good reason NOT to go GPL/etc and allow anyone to host their work.
Hey, it is what I would do if I was stupid enough to try and make this a business. :)
Blackhaven May 6th 2009 4:26PM
Blackhaven said...
Tuhljin said "editing addon code to remove copyright notices and to make it look like addons are up to date that are not"
Is WoWMatrix open sourced or did someone crack the code? If someone cracked the code why should I believe the words of a criminal that someone is being deceitful?
You called me a "petty thief" over on the WoWInsider forums just because I said I said I don't buy CD's but go to the concerts where artists make more money and claimed I lost the argument due to the fact I was a thief. I didn't say I stole anything, just because I stopped buying CD's doesn't mean I get them by ill means which legally I could do in my country regardless.
If you forgot:
http://www.wowinterface.com/forums/showpost.php?p=132145&postcount=955
Hoggersbud May 6th 2009 4:47PM
Tal said:
>Maybe I don't understand fully what WoWMatrix was doing but if they provided a application that consumes public facing content from something other than a web browser, how is that stealing bandwidth? As a software developer, I could write a utility application myself that does the same thing. That's not stealing bandwidth. I could then give that same utility application to my friends to use, they are not stealing bandwidth, nor am I.
Question: Do you realize that websites, like Curse, Slashdot, WowInsider, Google, and other resources on the net, are paying companies such as AT&T, GoDaddy, Akamai, for the use of their networks? That Curse doesn't just magically appear on the Internet, but have to pay somebody for the privelege? Even your own ISP has a contract with somebody for usage of bandwidth beyond their network.
If you don't understand this, then that's why you might not understand what's happening.
Slyzer May 6th 2009 4:58PM
Call me Naive, but I have tremendous faith in the WoWI updater, the WoWUI Minion. It does all the things that Curse did, but for free, with the potential to do what WoWM could do.
Hoggersbud May 6th 2009 5:18PM
>If was a more paranoid man I would think curse or wowinterface people were posting here also. :)
Why be paranoid Mr. Magoo? Several of them are around, and have been openly posting with their affiliation known to one and all.
They have nothing to hide.
Saithir May 6th 2009 6:24PM
@Slyzer - welcome to the XXI century, traveler from the future! ;P
I don't want to say it will not be good - I saw the screenshot and it looks nice (simple and to the point like WM's app is), but seriously...
It should be out and on our PCs before the whole thing happened.
Mr Magoo May 6th 2009 6:32PM
@Hoggersbud
Hey there. :)
It is proper posting form to state your affiliation in your post if you are being open about who you are and it might be unclear. I don't know the employees or people from either side by name. If you are saying they are posting under their real names or their avatars, then that is great - but I have no way of knowing that without spending my time looking up lists of employees or forums on other web sites??!
I am not referring to the post AFTER mine, in which it is clear that he is from WM because he uses the personal tense. :)
Tuhljin's post (for example) is not so clear. I have no idea who he is (nor should I), but his response APPEARS to be taking things very personally and is clearly on one side of the fence.
Hence my comment.