Blizzard: Arenas were a mistake.
by Michael Sacco 
Nov 13th 2009 at 5:50PM
He begins by saying that he wishes that the servers had been more stable at launch, and that there had been more of them, but he says that in terms of design, Arenas were the single biggest mistake in WoW's history.
Says Pardo:
Pardo indicates that most of the changes to the game since launch have been a success -- the shrinking of raid sizes, the addition of Heroic dungeons, etc -- but that Arena has been a huge headache for Blizzard and players alike. He goes on to say that if he had the choice, he'd either go back to WoW's beginnings and change the fundamentals of class balance, or, barring that, would nix the decision to add Arenas during the development of the Burning Crusade expansion.We didn't engineer the game and classes and balance around it, we just added it on, so it continues to be very difficult to balance. Is WoW a PvE cooperative game, or a competitive PvP game? There's constant pressure on the class balance team, there's pressure on the game itself, and a lot of times players who don't PvP don't understand why their classes are changing. I don't think we ever foresaw how much tuning and tweaking we'd have to do to balance it in that direction.
A pretty candid statement about a pretty controversial topic. It's good to see that Blizzard understands that the implementation of Arenas was a mistake for a game like WoW. Of course, Pardo also says that they can't just axe Arenas completely, at least not yet, so we may be stuck with them for a while. Sorry about your PvE burst damage, guys.
You can read the full interview with Rob at the Warcry Network. It's not all about Arena, I promise.
Filed under: The Burning Crusade, Wrath of the Lich King, Arena, Hardware
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 9)
Ryuker Nov 13th 2009 5:55PM
It's about time they admitted it.
Kyle Nov 13th 2009 6:00PM
i'm just sick of all the class balance trying to make every class competitive against every other class. WoW is overall a cooperative game that requires teamwork, in PvE and PvP situations. small arena games has put way too much stress on the game.
Ringo Flinthammer Nov 13th 2009 6:25PM
Making classes competitive with other classes is driven by PvE, not PvP. If there's one best tank class/spec, one best DPS class/spec or one best healer/spec, guess which one will dominate PvE, leaving everyone else out in the cold?
WoWie Zowie Nov 13th 2009 6:30PM
i think there was a wowinsider article like a year ago asking the same question: what is the biggest wow mistake. and the players overwhelmingly had said balancing pvp and pve in the same talent trees.
Clevins Nov 13th 2009 6:39PM
I've never understood why they don't simply alter the spell coefficients etc on zoning in to an Arena. I have to think it would be easier to balance for Arena if you didn't have to account for the impact of Arena balance chances in the rest of the game. Simply use two separate rulesets.
Eshin Nov 13th 2009 7:08PM
Wish they could try to plan out a few other trees for PVP only. EG you could only activate them in an Arena or BG... then again might go against their "Keep it easy" but I think in the arenas for the most part the people are pretty hard core.
Taladan Nov 13th 2009 7:25PM
"Hm, let's see... what can I say to make the vocal majority happy like me? I know, I'll say 'arenas suck'."
Utakata Nov 13th 2009 8:06PM
Yep. Mr. Pardo, justed stated what I have concluded during TBC. And this is a long time vindication to many of us who our voices where drowned out by the pro-Arena camp. As well as a promising sign of good things to for PvP if not, PvE...
...it appears the Goblin in a tuxedo has just been given a layoff notice.
Entropy Nov 13th 2009 8:51PM
The problem with arenas is that they magnify PvP imbalances. Its harder to tell what class has an edge in the battlegrounds or in world PvP - too many factors are in play.
I'm fully aware of how complicated and inconvenient it is to try to balance PvE and PvP at the same time. Thats why Rob Pardo (and many gamers) wish arenas didn't exist in the first place. During all that balancing, I'm sure that [insert class YOU play here] will undergo some nerfs.
You all act like balancing PvE and PvP game play in WoW is impossible - something that shouldn't even be attempted. I say it is a new exciting area in the field of game design. Bring it on.
Psiwave Nov 14th 2009 3:13AM
You all act like balancing PvE and PvP game play in WoW is impossible - something that shouldn't even be attempted. I say it is a new exciting area in the field of game design. Bring it on.
I say it's a waste of time and resources on a game that is already established in the Market and is leading to a far from exciting homogenisation of the classes. Take it away.
BooMsx Nov 14th 2009 5:13AM
Even without PvP nerfs will still happen (maybe not so often but still) like the rogue FoK nerf (that made me really sad panda) i enjoy both PvE and PvP but PvE is still the larger part of the game imho ^_^
Thander Nov 14th 2009 12:31PM
@Clevins
From what I've read from Blizzard, it would require a major recode of the game engine. It would have to be added in an expansion. I guess we can hope for it in Cataclysm, but I think they are slowly getting there with class balance. No new skills in Cata means, no new balance issues to be fixed except maybe the new path thing whatever it does. We can expect two rulesets in their next MMO if it ends up having PvE and PvP.
Xoshe Nov 14th 2009 1:49PM
@ Clevins/Thander
I haven't really read that myself, from the comments I've seen. GC has actually answered this topic a few times, and it's basically that they don't want PvP and PvE to be 2 separate games.
While there are some abilities that do act differently in PvP and PvE (which are pretty much just CC durations), if -everything- acted different then you might as well be playing different games. Sure it might be easier to balance that way, but it's harder on the players to jump between them.
WoW is a game that includes PvP and PvE content, and they just plain don't want to put walls between each aspect. Remember, after all, there's PvP in more then just instanced zones. It would be pretty jarring to have the entire game suddenly change just because you got attacked by another player while attacking a mob.
joggoms Nov 17th 2009 10:23AM
Good to finally admit it. Now they need to get rid of them or stop changing PVE to 'fix' arenas.
Sinthar Nov 18th 2009 11:21AM
@Xoshe
I understand your comment, but PVE and PVP ARE different games. There are more changes in PVP (arena as that is the subject) than in anything else. You cannot use 1/2 the items in the game, your abilities are restricted (for those long CD's), and as the subject is about arena, there are no mobs to be 'jarred' about, as you wont swap from PVE to PVP spec. Even in world PVP if you engage a mob, in PVE spec, and get attacked by someone in PVP spec, you will be at a distinct disadvantage. Even your class makes a huge difference.
Arena was an 'extra' that has taken over a lot of the development and balance of the 'normal' PVE game, so i think people are quite justified to complain about it. I do NOT advocate removing it, as it does add to the game for many people, however seperating it from the world PVP, BG PVP and esp PVE is imo the best course. I would even go so far to say why not dedicate servers to it, much like the PTR, and remove it from the normal world.
Anyhow that my thoughts on it.
Have fun everyone
Mugutu Nov 13th 2009 5:56PM
Glad to know it's not just me that thinks this.
Delterius Nov 13th 2009 6:32PM
Oh me too. I hope that this is one of the first signs of Warcraft's return to WoW.
Mediator Nov 13th 2009 5:57PM
Surprising? No. They've been saying for a while they've regretted how arena turned out. Don't mistake that for them admitting that they don't think there should be PvP balance. The alternative to arena was rated battlegrounds, and that would still require balance - just not the awkward balancing for 3 different sizes of close quarters combat at once that they had to do. In Cataclysm, I fully expect PvP balancing to occur that has impacts on PvE - it just won't be so often and cause some rippling effects, since the scale of battlegrounds should be more in line with the scale of raids.
Heilig Nov 13th 2009 7:22PM
Rated battlegrounds are not the only alternative to arenas. They could have also said "Hey, this is a PvE game, PvP is just for when you get bored and want a change of pace, it's NOT a PvP game and we're not giving you commensurate rewards. Why? Because it's our game and that's the way we want it."
Nick S Nov 13th 2009 11:32PM
I think Blizz could do with more of a "this is our game, and this is how we want it" attitude these days.